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Post by roman on Nov 13, 2014 18:01:25 GMT -6
As i am also blessed with a butt women love, i am anxious to see how my fit will be. I have a pair of peach-id in the mail to me as we speak. Not just women. Grrrrrrr Anyone notice the lawless phone number is no longer in service? We are hear griffin. Cox our service provider has had issue with thier phone lines all day. They have been hit and miss most of the day. We hope thy have this fixed Soon. |
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Post by highlights on Nov 13, 2014 19:16:16 GMT -6
exophobe; I agree with your statements regarding the comment on style forum that Lawless is "stealing" Roys fan-stitch....that's silly. I believe that Guns and Money utilized the fan stitch as well. highlights can confirm that. Ickes and Exophobe: Completely with you guys - what a silly & counter-productive observation on style forum! Feel certain that both Chris Machiaverno (Guns & Money) and Roy would find that person's views ludicrous/totally uninformed. Big slice of US workwear/denim heritage was joined at the hip to the development of US industrial sewing machines (famously, "Union Special") which made production possible. No-one exclusively owns this - it was planted in the pantry of possibilities by US (industrial machinery) manufacturers way back in the day. Buy the machine, learn how to operate and maintain it... & you own its potential. Shame is, ONLY denim brands/ceo's of brands w/ genuine love & commitment to Denimworld will employ these possibilities...so that they can be fully proud of their product in the knowledge that they're goin' the extra mile to deliver the goods...quality goods...so that the industry is progressive, creative, vigilant and FUN/WOW! - not stuck in the mud of stagnation. Raisin' the Bar. IMO, folks like Roman and Roy are artists/creatives who, in their own ways, respect...& venerate their medium and do their best to DELIVER. These guys take it from the Top. Respect and admiration. |
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Post by Dirty_Denim on Nov 13, 2014 19:23:30 GMT -6
Dirty_Denim i probably shouldn't have included the photo in my post. that photo is actually from when the jeans were brand new and was simply used to illustrate where the 'bubbling' is taking place. i'll try to get a better one posted tomorrow. based on your description of the yoke bubbling outward i'm pretty sure that you're correctly envisioning what is happening. i do have a bit of a butt, and the point of the yoke sits right at the top...so perhaps upward pressure from the curve of my butt and the downward pressure from my belt cause that bubbling across the yoke. *shrug* the angle of the yoke on these is a bit more steep than some of my other jeans, as well as the slightly higher rise. i'm curious if the pairs i have in the works will have a slightly lower rise and if the same thing will happen. Here's a photo of what I'm referring to with this pair. Overall a minor issue, but thought I'd mention it as this and a few seams that aren't laser straight are the only real constructive criticisms I have for these: If you look here you can see these jeans at one time were likely doing the same thing. U can see it still has a similar thing going on but looks to have softened up with wear and wash http://instagram.com/p/teBQacBbvS |
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Post by Dirty_Denim on Nov 13, 2014 20:01:09 GMT -6
exophobe; I agree with your statements regarding the comment on style forum that Lawless is "stealing" Roys fan-stitch....that's silly. I believe that Guns and Money utilized the fan stitch as well. highlights can confirm that. Ickes and Exophobe: Completely with you guys - what a silly & counter-productive observation on style forum. Feel certain that both Chris Machiaverno (Guns & Money) and Roy would find that person's views as being ludicrous/totally uninformed. Big slice of US workwear/denim heritage was joined at the hip to the development of US industrial sewing machines (famously, "Union Special") which made production possible. No-one exclusively owns this - it was planted in the pantry of possibilities by US (industrial machinery) manufacturers way back in the day. Buy the machine, learn how to operate and maintain it... & you own its potential. Shame is, ONLY denim brands/ceo's of brands w/ genuine love & commitment to Denimworld will employ these possibilities...so that they can be fully proud of their product in the knowledge that they're goin' the extra mile to deliver the goods...quality goods...so that the industry is progressive, creative and vigilant - not stuck in the mud of stagnation. Raisin' the Bar. IMO, folks like Roman and Roy are artists/creatives who, in their own ways, respect...& venerate their medium and do their best to DELIVER. These guys take it from the Top. Respect and admiration. Just so you guys know the guy who said that is Kiya Babazani the owner of Self Edge who has exclusive rights to sell Roy jeans as well as a piece of 3Sixteen i think. This is why he said it and likely showed to ROY as well. I understand people are trained to compare as we like to measure everything but just because someone uses something after you doesn'tmean they took the idea from you. Lawless is a custom shop who can do just about anything and with ease. What is really scary is how new Lawless is. I mean in a lil over a year look at what has been accomplished. Yes there are expereinced people here but as a company we are young. I can only imagine what we will be like in 5 years or a year even |
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Post by exophobe on Nov 13, 2014 20:32:28 GMT -6
Just so you guys know the guy who said that is Kiya Babazani the owner of Self Edge who has exclusive rights to sell Roy jeans as well as some kind or piece of 3Sixteen. This is why he said it and likely showed to ROY as well. I understand people are trained to compare as we like to measure everything but just because someone uses something after you doesn'tmean they took the idea from you. Lawless is a custom shop who can do just about anything and with ease. What is really scary is how new Lawless is. I mean in a lil over a year look at what has been accomplished. Yes there are expereinced people here but as a company we are young. I can only imagine what we will be like in 5 years or a year even That sheds a bit of a different light on it, since it's more of a defense than an attack, but still, the dude that designed the machine is the guy that deserves credit. It takes a developed skill to run them, but the guy who drives the car rarely claims credit for engineering it.  Anyway, not meaning to attack him, but it's severely unfair to make such a comment when one is deeply involved in the business and knows better -- but he's standing up for his friend/partner, so it makes sense. The thing is, no one is trying to take anything away from someone who is successful making single run jeans in his own workshop. And even though we love our Gustin and Lawless, we still venerate Iron Heart, Roy, and Pure Blue Japan, because we know those are also very special in their way. As one not in a position to drop more than $300 on a single item of clothing, I truly appreciate what Gustin, Lawless, Ciano Farmer, and all the other "little guys" are doing, bringing quality fabrics and truly supporting American industry by employing and fairly paying their people (if you guys aren't, then I wanna have words with you) to put out product they care about. This is truly what makes me passionate about these brands, and why I look forward to continuing to support them. |
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Post by Derek G on Nov 13, 2014 20:43:52 GMT -6
So there are a couple strange things here, which actually enforce your point. Your gustin "crotch seam" appears to be missing both the accompanying blue stitch that goes down the inseam, and the bar-tack in the four-way seam. It could just be the picture (the blue stitch does come close to disappearing in indigo), but if both of those are indeed missing I certainly understand your assessment. Indeed my noobishness shines through...The blue stitch is there...I will change the comments in the picture right now, as I DO NOT want to post false descriptions about G and want to be fair in my comparision...thanks for pointing that out, however, the rest of the pics and descriptions hold true. |
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Post by exophobe on Nov 13, 2014 21:35:33 GMT -6
Indeed my noobishness shines through...The blue stitch is there...I will change the comments in the picture right now, as I DO NOT want to post false descriptions about G and want to be fair in my comparision...thanks for pointing that out, however, the rest of the pics and descriptions hold true. It doesn't have a blue bar-tack, does it? It seems to me that that is missing. The other thing I kinda wanted to say... The blowouts I've seen are usually in the fabric, rather than the seams. So honestly, the one with the stronger seam is more likely to have a blowout. Honestly, though, the ones seeing the heaviest activity while dirty are technically those most likely to blow out, since the dirt acts as an abrasive on the fabric "sanding down" the threads. The wax coating will help with that, though, so it'll probably be a draw between the 16oz indigo and the 11/12oz waxed black. Still, I like the triple seam better on those close up shots than I thought i would. |
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Post by highlights on Nov 13, 2014 22:10:31 GMT -6
Mr Babazani's comments are so disappointing! He needs to get less obsessed w/ pre-emptive shots to keep his boundary fences/self interests covered, imo. Time's here for cooperation, collaboration...common purpose within the industry. More sunshine, more fun...appreciation of proliferation, diversity. I wanna see DenimMeisters being COOL. Ancient wisdom: Catch more flies w/ honey than vinegar. Don't see Giles IH being provocative, rude etc...he hits home runs for the Blue Team by setting an example that benefits denim & the folks who love it. We're all part of the Party...and until Mr B chooses to reveal his more noble self (which I'm sure exists) I will be willing to buy any of Mr. B's merchandise - but not from Mr B shops. Very disappointing.
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Post by Derek G on Nov 13, 2014 22:26:49 GMT -6
Indeed my noobishness shines through...The blue stitch is there...I will change the comments in the picture right now, as I DO NOT want to post false descriptions about G and want to be fair in my comparision...thanks for pointing that out, however, the rest of the pics and descriptions hold true. It doesn't have a blue bar-tack, does it? It seems to me that that is missing. The other thing I kinda wanted to say... The blowouts I've seen are usually in the fabric, rather than the seams. So honestly, the one with the stronger seam is more likely to have a blowout. Honestly, though, the ones seeing the heaviest activity while dirty are technically those most likely to blow out, since the dirt acts as an abrasive on the fabric "sanding down" the threads. The wax coating will help with that, though, so it'll probably be a draw between the 16oz indigo and the 11/12oz waxed black. Still, I like the triple seam better on those close up shots than I thought i would. There is no bar tack, and a subject that was brought up long ago on the G board, that, I believe started with this run of the 16ers...no bar tacks. Backed in Jan 2014. There were lots of complaints about this...in all fairness, I don't recall anyone saying that they returned them because of it. Obviously, me included  as I said, I love my 16ers my first heavy denim....looking forward to what Lawless will bring to the table...with Roman buying a machine capable of sewing 24 oz denim..... EDIT: I changed the description of G's having only one stitch to a double stitch, and explanation that you can't see the blue stitch....also removed the comment of "which one do you think will blow out first" because, in hindsight, it almost seem like a flame against G....I do want to be fair |
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Post by exophobe on Nov 13, 2014 22:40:50 GMT -6
There is no bar tack, and a subject that was brought up long ago on the G board, that, I believe started with this run of the 16ers...no bar tacks. Backed in Jan 2014. There were lots of complaints about this...in all fairness, I don't recall anyone saying that they returned them because of it. Obviously, me included as I said, I love my 16ers my first heavy denim....looking forward to what Lawless will bring to the table...with Roman buying a machine capable of sewing 24 oz denim..... Interesting. Well, I should be able to tell you around the beginning of December if they're still not doing the bar-tack on the Am16er. Now that I can wear boots again, I've actually been enjoying me HAs (straight cut, swallows smaller shoes on me), so they have me a little more excited for the Am16. I'm guessing they broke too many sewing machines with their heavy projects, I'd be interested to get a more mechanical perspective on that (though I understand the thickness of the material, etc), since it seems the expensive guys have no trouble getting needles through the super-heavies (or maybe they do, and this is worked into the cost of the jeans). I would think with the love for the vintage machines there's gotta be some trick to it. And I want to say denim used to be a lot thicker ( Old26? ) so it seems like 14-16 would have been the average when these things were originally in operation. |
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Post by Derek G on Nov 13, 2014 22:48:53 GMT -6
exophobe , all my others, 5 pair, ordered after that. have the bar tack....but in tonal thread, not red, so hopefully you're good to go on that This run was the only one I know of, that had missing tacks Edit I heard....could be one of those myths, That back in the day, when Levi put XX on the tag, It meant 20 oz denim. Either way, as far as Levi's go, They definitely used heavier denim than today....Your 14-16 oz assessment probably is correct
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Post by exophobe on Nov 13, 2014 22:51:57 GMT -6
exophobe , all my others, 5 pair, ordered after that. have the bar tack....but in tonal thread, not red, so hopefully you're good to go on that This run was the only one I know of, that had missing tacks so you got a LIMITED EDITION you lucky so and so! I'm not too worried, in certain situations it's better not to have a bright red spot right in the middle of your crotch, so I could live with it. I think my Black x Coal might have it (in black), but now I have to check when I get home. |
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Post by Derek G on Nov 13, 2014 22:59:57 GMT -6
exophobe , all my others, 5 pair, ordered after that. have the bar tack....but in tonal thread, not red, so hopefully you're good to go on that This run was the only one I know of, that had missing tacks so you got a LIMITED EDITION you lucky so and so! I'm not too worried, in certain situations it's better not to have a bright red spot right in the middle of your crotch, so I could live with it. I think my Black x Coal might have it (in black), but now I have to check when I get home. ROTFLOL! Yeah, limited ..already broke in...no wait, anybody want them? 300 bucks  jk...I think I'm getting chatty here and getting off topic...damn that live feed Idk ...That flash of red could get chicks to glance at ur package lol....ok, I'm done |
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Post by Mattbert on Nov 13, 2014 23:03:32 GMT -6
I'm not too worried, in certain situations it's better not to have a bright red spot right in the middle of your crotch No kidding. Bending over in those to tie your shoe in the middle of a paintball tournament is a mistake you only make once. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2014 23:27:56 GMT -6
there were a few runs of varyious denims that didn't get the bar tacks in the crotch around the same time. my okayama standards don't have one either. IIRC Gustin said that some needles had been snapped when bar-tacking a few 'heavier' denims. |
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Post by Old26 on Nov 14, 2014 9:28:39 GMT -6
There is no bar tack, and a subject that was brought up long ago on the G board, that, I believe started with this run of the 16ers...no bar tacks. Backed in Jan 2014. There were lots of complaints about this...in all fairness, I don't recall anyone saying that they returned them because of it. Obviously, me included as I said, I love my 16ers my first heavy denim....looking forward to what Lawless will bring to the table...with Roman buying a machine capable of sewing 24 oz denim..... Interesting. Well, I should be able to tell you around the beginning of December if they're still not doing the bar-tack on the Am16er. Now that I can wear boots again, I've actually been enjoying me HAs (straight cut, swallows smaller shoes on me), so they have me a little more excited for the Am16. I'm guessing they broke too many sewing machines with their heavy projects, I'd be interested to get a more mechanical perspective on that (though I understand the thickness of the material, etc), since it seems the expensive guys have no trouble getting needles through the super-heavies (or maybe they do, and this is worked into the cost of the jeans). I would think with the love for the vintage machines there's gotta be some trick to it. And I want to say denim used to be a lot thicker ( Old26? ) so it seems like 14-16 would have been the average when these things were originally in operation. I recall denim being heavy and stiff when I was a kid. BTW - my 26oz Gustin Beasts have a red bar tack in the crotch. Thank god, that's my strong point. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2014 11:04:01 GMT -6
" And I want to say denim used to be a lot thicker "
No idea of the actual weight but there wasn't any light weight denim and all of it was loom state. We'd buy them way big. Mom would wash them twice before they were worn to shrink and soften. Even then they would make the inside of your knee hurt.
No experience with sewing but if the needles are the weak point maybe they aren't made the same now as they were?
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Post by exophobe on Nov 14, 2014 11:45:27 GMT -6
" And I want to say denim used to be a lot thicker " No idea of the actual weight but there wasn't any light weight denim and all of it was loom state. We'd buy them way big. Mom would wash them twice before they were worn to shrink and soften. Even then they would make the inside of your knee hurt. No experience with sewing but if the needles are the weak point maybe they aren't made the same now as they were? (I think it's a symptom of the care that the shop was using in the construction of Gustin garments at the time, more than a matter of the material) Machines are the same, needles are likely the same (probably even the same factory they've always been made at), and I'd guess with the way American machinery used to be built, those machines could punch aluminum if you wanted them to, or bartack your hand. If I wanna go way off the reservation, the increased order volume from both Gustin and Tellason (with the selvedge boom going on) forced the show to hire more people, and their training was seen in the issues we all experienced with Gustin at the beginning of the year. But that's conspiracy theory, and I don't wanna go there. |
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Post by Winterland on Nov 14, 2014 15:22:37 GMT -6
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Post by matt on Nov 17, 2014 15:15:03 GMT -6
Back to the reviews - I just picked up my 18.5 oz., and I'll be quick (I'll write more in a couple of days, along with posting pics) - I want to say thank you to roman, @laura and the whole LD team - these jeans are perfect. I'm not overhyping - the fit is perfect, a perfect slim straight fit. I love the triple stitching on the inseam, as well as fan stitch inside the fly. I opted for the following on these: - Honey wheat stitching - White copper buttons - Light blue & white inside lining - Double chain These heavyweights are going to need some quality time to break them in. |
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Post by stinky on Nov 17, 2014 19:49:01 GMT -6
Shipping notice for promo pair received. All I provided was the waist, inseam, and cut, so I have absolutely no clue what will show up in the mailbox. It's going to be like early xmas around here (to match the weather).
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2014 20:01:25 GMT -6
Shipping notice for promo pair received. All I provided was the waist, inseam, and cut, so I have absolutely no clue what will show up in the mailbox. It's going to be like early xmas around here (to match the weather). the ship notice didn't indicate which denim was used? Total surprise! |
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Post by stinky on Nov 17, 2014 20:16:39 GMT -6
Shipping notice for promo pair received. All I provided was the waist, inseam, and cut, so I have absolutely no clue what will show up in the mailbox. It's going to be like early xmas around here (to match the weather). the ship notice didn't indicate which denim was used? Total surprise! it said, description: item quantity: 1 price: $0.00 Maybe I'm getting a white pair of jeans with the word "jeans" written in black block letters? I'll drink one of these when I review:  |
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Post by Griffin on Nov 18, 2014 2:54:23 GMT -6
Lol donald duck beer  |
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Post by Griffin on Nov 19, 2014 10:41:38 GMT -6
I just got my free pair of jeans from MattbertThey fit. They are amazeballs! (really, they are so great) Fit pics coming. |
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as I said, I love my 16ers 
jk...I think I'm getting chatty here and getting off topic...damn that live feed 
