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Post by Whiskey Mercenary on Mar 9, 2015 11:31:22 GMT -6
I think you did well. Polite but firm in your view. I'm glad they will get it turned around so quickly for you, please post an amended review once the new one comes in.
He did kinda try to gloss over the fabric change like it was a mistake, but it was obviously deliberate if they explained in on the packaging slip.
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Post by jeffrx on Mar 9, 2015 11:39:45 GMT -6
Roman should have just realized that it was a total f!@k up and offered to send you a new jacket AND let you keep that one. that would have been the correct response. Instead, he is inconveniencing you even further. It's bullshit.
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Post by julian on Mar 9, 2015 11:41:03 GMT -6
i don't know if it is really fair to give you the chat i get with roman. But i would like to know what's your opinion about that. what do you think i should do? You handled it well and, ultimately, I also feel Roman handled it well. The refund on your other order is a fair way to address the shipping cost (assuming you had no intention of cancelling it, of course). Some of the aspects of the conversation do throw up more questions than answers, though. They now seem able to completely create a new jacket, from cutting to being sewn, within a week. Hmm. It makes me wonder whether one reason the standard orders are taking so long to complete is because they're having to re-do previous orders on a wide-scale basis. |
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Post by exophobe on Mar 9, 2015 11:42:15 GMT -6
So to me it seems that LD just sent you something they had with the hopes you would be fine with it. But Indigo to Black!?!?! I'm not sure i buy the we ran out of that denim, excuse. This would/does make me think that I won't invest anymore with LD. There are way to many half ass excuses. Or stall tactics. I'd much rather a true statement. "We screwed up and here is how we'd like to fix it for you .... Does that work for you?" I think they asked for out phone #'s , just call, imagine that. They didn't run out, the roll was damaged. At least three people on this thread have reported the same thing, so if they're lying about it, then they are at least being consistent. Most other people have been contacted about these problems, though, perhaps being in France something else happened, I dunno, but the excuse they've been giving is not that they ran out, rather that the denim was rendered unusable. I'm assuming that Thomass has reached out to them, so perhaps they'll make some sort of peace offering. The Candiani Raven always looked indigo to me, and continues to in those photos (all but the close-ups). Not that that's an excuse, but it might not be as far off as it seems. However, as a person with a denim problem, I do recognize the substantial difference between the Japanese and Italian mills, which would likely be the part that upset me about that situation. |
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Post by DigDug on Mar 9, 2015 11:44:53 GMT -6
I think your frustration was appropriate. But I also think Romans response was appropriate as well (still frustrating and yes inconvenient).
But I can see why a small co. may have that policy.
People can really screw a small company and take advantage of them.
It still all Sucks.
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Post by Old26 on Mar 9, 2015 11:46:59 GMT -6
Just a fair warning that in general, unless both parties agree, we will not let folks post up private chats or emails here.
It's simply not fair to take a private convo and post it publicly.
So please, if this was not agreed upon by Roman, let me know and I'll nuke it. Hope yawl understand...
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Post by stinky on Mar 9, 2015 11:52:19 GMT -6
Here's what I don't understand . . . why do you post the exchange here and ask the group if the resolution was fair?
The only thing that matters is, do you think it's fair? If so, then yes, it's fair. If not, then tell Roman why you don't think it's fair and negotiate until you reach a point that you feel is fair.
It's that easy.
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Post by DigDug on Mar 9, 2015 11:52:25 GMT -6
My real problem with all these mishaps (wrong sizes, wrong styles, wrong fabrics) is that I don't see how a small start up can absorb redoing them all.
I'm ok (not happy, but ok) with waiting for my wrong sized shirts sent to me being redone. But where's the tipping point for Roman, where he throws his hands up and gives up (or for that matter his Staff?)?
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Post by Griffin on Mar 9, 2015 11:56:53 GMT -6
Just gotta say that it does look god damn awesome and i cant wait for mine in ixi. The folds on the front looks perfectamundo!
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Post by Whiskey Mercenary on Mar 9, 2015 12:02:44 GMT -6
My real problem with all these mishaps (wrong sizes, wrong styles, wrong fabrics) is that I don't see how a small start up can absorb redoing them all. I'm ok (not happy, but ok) with waiting for my wrong sized shirts sent to me being redone. But where's the tipping point for Roman, where he throws his hands up and gives up (or for that matter his Staff?)? Well, totally. But do it right in the first place and this isn't even a consideration. I don't feel bad to LD at all. I'm sure that's what you're saying as well. I'm really rooting for these guys, like, really. And I REALLY want my items. They've got some serious issues to fix though, that much is clear. |
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Post by Winterland on Mar 9, 2015 12:09:52 GMT -6
Sounds like a reasonable return action from Lawless. Feel free to explain what the outcome was for those who didn't see it.
Thanks for letting us know what happened even know we had to nix it. I'm sure you understand us playing it safe.
It is a good looking jacket looks like sizing was good.
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Post by brentkuz on Mar 9, 2015 12:10:00 GMT -6
Old26 - we can't post a conversation we had with a business unless we have two party consent? I see it as the minute you send an email to a customer you send it as a business and the business response to a question and/or issue and really shouldn't contain anything you would be embarrassed if it went public. We have been talking about how Cody or Ren dealt with an issue or error for months now. Or can we not post an image of the conversation but we can transcribe it?
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Post by thomasss on Mar 9, 2015 12:33:08 GMT -6
Here's what I don't understand . . . why do you post the exchange here and ask the group if the resolution was fair? The only thing that matters is, do you think it's fair? If so, then yes, it's fair. If not, then tell Roman why you don't think it's fair and negotiate until you reach a point that you feel is fair. It's that easy. i post this conversation because i wanted to have an advice from usual US customers. I wanted to keep the wrong jacket until i'm sure they send the right one but lawless told me it is not their company policy !!! But what do you want me to do. They have the power : you don't send it back, we don't send the new one. i never react like that with another company but if you ask me if i trust lawless : the answer is definitly NO. Ok, i send the wrong jacket back, who told me they will really send the new one in a week : does any of you believe that? me, i don't. nevermind, i will send the wrong jacket back because i have no choice and cross my finger to get the new one in less than 17 weeks !!! Old26 : sorry for the retyranscription of the conversation, it was not a good idea. |
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Post by Old26 on Mar 9, 2015 12:37:30 GMT -6
Old26 - we can't post a conversation we had with a business unless we have two party consent? I see it as the minute you send an email to a customer you send it as a business and the business response to a question and/or issue and really shouldn't contain anything you would be embarrassed if it went public. We have been talking about how Cody or Ren dealt with an issue or error for months now. Or can we not post an image of the conversation but we can transcribe it? We are not going to post these PRIVATE comm's period without both parties consent. It matters not what the content is. It's just that simple. It sets up the poster and us for legal implications. This has been discussed on various forums over the years and it's a pretty typical mode of operation. What I say in email or PM is not intended for public consumption. We will also show others that same respect. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2015 13:20:53 GMT -6
i didn't see the message, but get the gist from the subsequent responses...an expedited replacement upon return of the initial incorrect one? in theory that is a sensible and fair deal...but has anyone actually gotten their 'expedited' re-worked items yet? i know at least two people here have posted a similar commitment...but don't recall anyone receiving re-worked items yet (expedited).
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Post by thomasss on Mar 9, 2015 14:23:55 GMT -6
but don't recall anyone receiving re-worked items yet (expedited). that's what i'm afraid of... i'll ask lawless for a refund for this order and the 2 others : i don't want to deal anymore with lawless !!! |
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Post by ickes on Mar 9, 2015 14:47:18 GMT -6
This is too bad, Lawless is losing customers and rightly so. This is exactly why they needed Sal as I believe he would have helped take care of these issues and turn the company around a bit.
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jdtmn
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Post by jdtmn on Mar 9, 2015 16:46:15 GMT -6
i didn't see the message, but get the gist from the subsequent responses...an expedited replacement upon return of the initial incorrect one? in theory that is a sensible and fair deal...but has anyone actually gotten their 'expedited' re-worked items yet? i know at least two people here have posted a similar commitment...but don't recall anyone receiving re-worked items yet (expedited). I was sent a KS pair in the incorrect denim. I was an early backer of the limited broken weave black selvedge. I got some type of grayish indigo. Very disappointed, I reached out to both Sal and Roman. (Its just plain silly in my opinion to accept anything other than exactly what you paid for.) They apologized and had me send them back and assured me an expedited fix. Never heard what happened with the broken weave, but they confirmed with me the Oki standard like denim would be an acceptable substitute. I agreed and got them in about 4 weeks. Sal was very involved with the whole thing while he was on-site which I'm confident had a lot to do with the following through. |
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Post by brentkuz on Mar 9, 2015 17:04:59 GMT -6
If you change your mind and sell the jacket let me know it should be a good fit for me. As long as the forearms aren't tight as crap.
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Post by Winterland on Mar 9, 2015 22:23:57 GMT -6
but don't recall anyone receiving re-worked items yet (expedited). that's what i'm afraid of... i'll ask lawless for a refund for this order and the 2 others : i don't want to deal anymore with lawless !!! Had a shirt come in as wrong style. I didn't have any problem sending back as they will then start a new expedited one. They have had it back for a week. We will see how long it takes for the new shirt. I did ask about just keeping it as I figured someone here would probably buy it but they wanted it back. I would have been willing to pay as I would basically be buying 2 shirts and would get my money back by selling it. |
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Post by chrisdoth on Mar 10, 2015 6:45:14 GMT -6
My real problem with all these mishaps (wrong sizes, wrong styles, wrong fabrics) is that I don't see how a small start up can absorb redoing them all. I'm ok (not happy, but ok) with waiting for my wrong sized shirts sent to me being redone. But where's the tipping point for Roman, where he throws his hands up and gives up (or for that matter his Staff?)? Given they've been in business since 2012 you would think they would have better systems in place. I understand that they have/are tying to expand their business but it seems they've overextended themselves in all areas. Hope the OP eventually gets a jacket he is happy with in the colour he ordered. |
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Post by jackgordon on Mar 11, 2015 1:05:32 GMT -6
That is really incredible that anyone could think that was an acceptable thing to do. And such a careless letter to explain it.
Can anyone offer any suggestions as to why these problems keep occurring? And why send things out that are so blatantly incorrect?
It's not as if anything is being sent out wrong in order to meet the 8-10 week wait time: we're already well past that. How hard is it to hold up a finished item against its order form and check it all lines up before packing it for postage?
If it's wrong, just don't send the f!@king thing and hold on to it in the limited inventory and sell it full price. I'm sure someone would have been happy to pay full price for a Type 2 in Candiani Raven shipped out the same day.
It's all pretty weird and very frustrating.
Aside from all that, the jacket looks tidy. I hope my type 2 arrives to something like the specs I ordered. It's #304, so I hope I'm not crazy to think it shouldn't be too far away now.
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Post by thomasss on Mar 11, 2015 6:57:06 GMT -6
If you change your mind and sell the jacket let me know it should be a good fit for me. As long as the forearms aren't tight as crap. as i read so many issues right now for a refunding, i prefered sent it back and hoppefully get the right one in few weeks !!!  (crossed fingers) |
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Post by oatwilly on Mar 11, 2015 19:13:07 GMT -6
sounds like they just happened to have that black jacket sitting around, possibly due to a cancellation or return, and just decided to fill your order with it. I think just pushing any old shit out the door is their priority right now. I highly doubt they made a decision that since they were out of dova, that they would substitute that fabric for black and then went to the trouble to actually make that jacket, knowing full well shit would hit the fan with the customer and would ultimately only be a fruitless waste of time and materials
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Post by oatwilly on Mar 11, 2015 19:24:47 GMT -6
Roman should have just realized that it was a total f!@k up and offered to send you a new jacket AND let you keep that one. that would have been the correct response. Instead, he is inconveniencing you even further. It's bullshit. They need that jacket back so they can use it to fill another order  |
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