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Post by wisdom on Oct 27, 2014 9:36:37 GMT -6
Is it just me, or does anybody else suspect the percentage funding is being fudged a bit? I have no proof of this, but I don't see how there can be such a steady and consistent flow of backers for really slow moving products, like the current Heavy American and some accessories, like belts. It goes against their strategy of holding no inventory, since funding material to anticipate future demand will inevitably result in inventory, but there's an opportunity cost associated with a product that fails to fund. Also, Gustin saves a bit of money by shipping larger quantities, either through volume discounts or reduced shipping cost per unit.. it's possible they carry inventory of their staple products (or even a slew of completed sizes). If they do this (again, no proof), I would see this as being a bit undisciplined, but they're closer to the supply/demand/cost picture than I am, so this presumed flexibility may be justified.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 9:43:07 GMT -6
Is it just me, or does anybody else suspect the percentage funding is being fudged a bit? I have no proof of this, but I don't see how there can be such a steady and consistent flow of backers for really slow moving products, like the current Heavy American and some accessories, like belts. It goes against their strategy of holding no inventory, since funding material to anticipate future demand will inevitably result in inventory, but there's an opportunity cost associated with a product that fails to fund. Also, Gustin saves a bit of money by shipping larger quantities, either through volume discounts or reduced shipping cost per unit.. it's possible they carry inventory of their staple products (or even a slew of completed sizes). If they do this (again, no proof), I would see this as being a bit undisciplined, but they're closer to the supply/demand/cost picture than I am, so this presumed flexibility may be justified. Fudged a bit? Ha... cannot laugh too loud in my office.... |
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Post by wisdom on Oct 27, 2014 9:47:26 GMT -6
Is it just me, or does anybody else suspect the percentage funding is being fudged a bit? I have no proof of this, but I don't see how there can be such a steady and consistent flow of backers for really slow moving products, like the current Heavy American and some accessories, like belts. It goes against their strategy of holding no inventory, since funding material to anticipate future demand will inevitably result in inventory, but there's an opportunity cost associated with a product that fails to fund. Also, Gustin saves a bit of money by shipping larger quantities, either through volume discounts or reduced shipping cost per unit.. it's possible they carry inventory of their staple products (or even a slew of completed sizes). If they do this (again, no proof), I would see this as being a bit undisciplined, but they're closer to the supply/demand/cost picture than I am, so this presumed flexibility may be justified. Fudged a bit? Ha... cannot laugh too loud in my office.... ..but I bet you could get away with wearing a pair of tonal jeans and workshirt there  |
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Post by Dirty_Denim on Oct 27, 2014 10:04:25 GMT -6
The stock store has to be their plan for all of this. SO if 70 of the 100 get backed I would think they will begin picking up the rest & pop them in the stock store for the people that just wont wait. I also cant see them selling returns that were either measured way off or made with flaws in the stock store. If thats what they are doing then we have a huge trust problem on our hands. That is a huge no no in my book. Selling shit at full price is blatant lying & bull shit. I just do not think they are doing that.
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Post by matt on Oct 27, 2014 10:26:30 GMT -6
Is it just me, or does anybody else suspect the percentage funding is being fudged a bit? I have no proof of this, but I don't see how there can be such a steady and consistent flow of backers for really slow moving products, like the current Heavy American and some accessories, like belts. It goes against their strategy of holding no inventory, since funding material to anticipate future demand will inevitably result in inventory, but there's an opportunity cost associated with a product that fails to fund. Also, Gustin saves a bit of money by shipping larger quantities, either through volume discounts or reduced shipping cost per unit.. it's possible they carry inventory of their staple products (or even a slew of completed sizes). If they do this (again, no proof), I would see this as being a bit undisciplined, but they're closer to the supply/demand/cost picture than I am, so this presumed flexibility may be justified. I tend to agree. If you look at the current options, the light khaki chinos, the camel CPO and the honey brown chore coat are all at risk at the moment (especially the chore coat). Although, things tend to pick up on Tuesday and Thursday release days. The chinos could make up the final 21% in two days. But I do see a couple of things that tend to help the funding - items with "2 days left" will be out there for 3 days (or more) if they are close to being fully funded. And as we know with denim, only so many pairs can be made with a certain yardage roll. I don't know, but perhaps there is an allocation of denim - perhaps the overrun of unused denim will turn into an apron or something? Just an idea. I do agree with Dirty Denim - I'd be more in favor of the stock store being the excess from incomplete runs (a few pairs of each in arbitrary or popular sizes) - but if that's the trend, then perhaps they should consider lowering the price point of the stock store since it's essentially denim nobody wanted in the first place - and we're helping them reduce overhead by moving it quickly. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 10:28:13 GMT -6
Yeah. with 1st run or more rare fabrics it seem like they still have to get into the high 80s or 90s before they'll guarantee a run. with repeat 'staple' fabrics i'm sure the number is much lower than that. something like the HAs or belts are on a consistent rotation of late and i'm guessing they have a pretty good working relationship with their vendor for those materials. overrun does go to the stock store with the added cost of the fulfillment center (and seems to empty out in a day or two) so they are making back some of that slop/risk. it's also difficult to say how many units are designated for each campaign, which could make a sizable difference.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 10:32:37 GMT -6
Is it just me, or does anybody else suspect the percentage funding is being fudged a bit? I have no proof of this, but I don't see how there can be such a steady and consistent flow of backers for really slow moving products, like the current Heavy American and some accessories, like belts. It goes against their strategy of holding no inventory, since funding material to anticipate future demand will inevitably result in inventory, but there's an opportunity cost associated with a product that fails to fund. Also, Gustin saves a bit of money by shipping larger quantities, either through volume discounts or reduced shipping cost per unit.. it's possible they carry inventory of their staple products (or even a slew of completed sizes). If they do this (again, no proof), I would see this as being a bit undisciplined, but they're closer to the supply/demand/cost picture than I am, so this presumed flexibility may be justified. I tend to agree. If you look at the current options, the light khaki chinos, the camel CPO and the honey brown chore coat are all at risk at the moment (especially the chore coat). Although, things tend to pick up on Tuesday and Thursday release days. The chinos could make up the final 21% in two days. But I do see a couple of things that tend to help the funding - items with "2 days left" will be out there for 3 days (or more) if they are close to being fully funded. And as we know with denim, only so many pairs can be made with a certain yardage roll. I don't know, but perhaps there is an allocation of denim - perhaps the overrun of unused denim will turn into an apron or something? Just an idea. I do agree with Dirty Denim - I'd be more in favor of the stock store being the excess from incomplete runs (a few pairs of each in arbitrary or popular sizes) - but if that's the trend, then perhaps they should consider lowering the price point of the stock store since it's essentially denim nobody wanted in the first place - and we're helping them reduce overhead by moving it quickly. Nothing ever at risk of not being funded. Except the demand is totally out of whack, it is more about Gustin willing to do the items or not. This whole KS model is a marketing plot. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 10:32:37 GMT -6
perhaps they should consider lowering the price point of the stock store since it's essentially denim nobody wanted in the first place - and we're helping them reduce overhead by moving it quickly. i don't see that happening. the stock store has been depleted in 1-2 days each time it was fully 'stocked'. i'm guessing G's views that as a success and has no reason to lower the prices. similar to any price increases that have happened...the stuff keeps selling. many of us hoped that they would stick to it and wouldn't be tempted to see what the market would bear...but it seems that they are...and the market seems to be bearing more than several of us appreciate |
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Post by matt on Oct 27, 2014 10:41:02 GMT -6
I do think Gustin gave up a fun gimmick with the grab bag - it was arbitrary and truly first come, first serve and the price discount benefited those who got in on the offer.
The stock store reinforces that (unfortunately) G is focused more on profit margins than on anything else.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 10:54:11 GMT -6
The stock store has to be their plan for all of this. SO if 70 of the 100 get backed I would think they will begin picking up the rest & pop them in the stock store for the people that just wont wait. I also cant see them selling returns that were either measured way off or made with flaws in the stock store. If thats what they are doing then we have a huge trust problem on our hands. That is a huge no no in my book. Selling shit at full price is blatant lying & bull shit. I just do not think they are doing that. Let's say 70% equal to 35 jeans. Gustin can just make the 35 jeans and done with it. No need to make the rest of the quantity that are not being backed. Frankly, the percentage is artificial and it is a "scarcity" marketing tactic for buyers to FEEL like they must rush to get something "limited". There are people out there that fit the type of customer profile who enjoy the "high" of buying products from scarcity model. Sometimes, working in marketing for too long take all the fun out of buying. |
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Post by bugula on Oct 27, 2014 11:03:01 GMT -6
i'd like for them to move to the early backer discount model and hold stock at a higher price like TS. do a run and get extras proportional to the popular sizes (ie. if 30, 32, 34 are ordered in abundance, have more in those sizes made than others) this way people still have incentive to back even though they have a wait and it satisfies those that want instant gratification.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 11:06:50 GMT -6
The stock store has to be their plan for all of this. SO if 70 of the 100 get backed I would think they will begin picking up the rest & pop them in the stock store for the people that just wont wait. I also cant see them selling returns that were either measured way off or made with flaws in the stock store. If thats what they are doing then we have a huge trust problem on our hands. That is a huge no no in my book. Selling shit at full price is blatant lying & bull shit. I just do not think they are doing that. Let's say 70% equal to 35 jeans. Gustin can just make the 35 jeans and done with it. No need to make the rest of the quantity that are not being backed. Frankly, the percentage is artificial and it is a "scarcity" marketing tactic for buyers to FEEL like they must rush to get something "limited". There are people out there that fit the type of customer profile who enjoy the "high" of buying products from scarcity model. Sometimes, working in marketing for too long take all the fun out of buying. but the above is only true if they have the fabric in hand. on the other hand they are likely negotiating a fabric price with the vendor based on a certain qty, and then only purchase once they have a commitment from customers for that qty. in that case why keep fabric on hand for 35 pairs? if their per unit price with the sew shop goes down if they do full runs, it makes more sense for them to sew up that fabric and off load it on the stock page. though...i don't think they're playing with such large percentages on unknown fabrics...only with often repeated ones. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 11:18:40 GMT -6
Let's say 70% equal to 35 jeans. Gustin can just make the 35 jeans and done with it. No need to make the rest of the quantity that are not being backed. Frankly, the percentage is artificial and it is a "scarcity" marketing tactic for buyers to FEEL like they must rush to get something "limited". There are people out there that fit the type of customer profile who enjoy the "high" of buying products from scarcity model. Sometimes, working in marketing for too long take all the fun out of buying. but the above is only true if they have the fabric in hand. on the other hand they are likely negotiating a fabric price with the vendor based on a certain qty, and then only purchase once they have a commitment from customers for that qty. in that case why keep fabric on hand for 35 pairs? if their per unit price with the sew shop goes down if they do full runs, it makes more sense for them to sew up that fabric and off load it on the stock page. though...i don't think they're playing with such large percentages on unknown fabrics...only with often repeated ones. Beside some of the silk fabric, based on my conversations with people who know, Gustin is getting the fabric the same place as everyone else. Many of the fabric maybe "rare" to us because Gustin doesn't offer them as often but those same fabric are always available from the wholesaler. Btw, do you remember there were few VERY LIMITED run of some repeat fabric? Those are mostly leftover from the earlier campaign. |
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Post by DigDug on Oct 27, 2014 11:29:29 GMT -6
Looks like that's it folks. No more community page. At least I cant login anymore. Hate the way this went down! I wear my Gustins every day and I've got enough denim to last for some time, Thanks Gustin.
I still want to hear from them but I doubt it. There done with us/me, I do take that personally!
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Post by bugula on Oct 27, 2014 11:31:10 GMT -6
G's model does give them the availability to experiment with fabrics moreso than other brands since it's funded experimentation. If N+F drop a bomb, they're out the production/distro costs. I'd like to see them to continue to go crazy down this path and offer materials to market that no one else would think to touch.
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Post by Old26 on Oct 27, 2014 11:50:40 GMT -6
Looks like that's it folks. No more community page. At least I cant login anymore. Hate the way this went down! I wear my Gustins every day and I've got enough denim to last for some time, Thanks Gustin. I still want to hear from them but I doubt it. There done with us/me, I do take that personally! Site is fine here. I can see everything... |
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Post by ickes on Oct 27, 2014 12:45:42 GMT -6
They absolutely fudge the numbers on items to get them funded. No doubt in my mind.
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Post by PaulR on Oct 27, 2014 15:42:52 GMT -6
The stock store has to be their plan for all of this. SO if 70 of the 100 get backed I would think they will begin picking up the rest & pop them in the stock store for the people that just wont wait. I also cant see them selling returns that were either measured way off or made with flaws in the stock store. If thats what they are doing then we have a huge trust problem on our hands. That is a huge no no in my book. Selling shit at full price is blatant lying & bull shit. I just do not think they are doing that. They also probably use some of that leftover denim scraps for their aprons...between the stock store and the aprons, plenty of ways to make money. Just wait until we get patchwork selvedge denim...  |
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Post by brentkuz on Oct 27, 2014 17:57:25 GMT -6
Sorta surprised the honey chore is moving slow. Good price.
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Post by Tobesjones on Oct 27, 2014 19:29:58 GMT -6
I do think Gustin gave up a fun gimmick with the grab bag - it was arbitrary and truly first come, first serve and the price discount benefited those who got in on the offer. The stock store reinforces that (unfortunately) G is focused more on profit margins than on anything else. Man I love the grab bag idea. A flat discount price was a great deal and the anticipation of gambling for possibly getting a great pair was a lot of fun. I never got anything spectacular but have some pairs I enjoy and never would have thought to bought myself. I actually picked up a grab bag in the stock store when it first was released to some of us so I hope it isn't dead. And yes the funding is a crock. Pure marketing gimmick. |
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Post by matt on Oct 27, 2014 19:38:19 GMT -6
Man I love the grab bag idea. A flat discount price was a great deal and the anticipation of gambling for possibly getting a great pair was a lot of fun. I never got anything spectacular but have some pairs I enjoy and never would have thought to bought myself. I actually picked up a grab bag in the stock store when it first was released to some of us so I hope it isn't dead. And yes the funding is a crock. Pure marketing gimmick. Best part of the grab bag - it was my first introduction into a heavier pair (American Sixteeners). I'm not sure how quickly I would've taken the dive on these had they not come via the grab back for $82. One of my favorite pairs. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 19:59:48 GMT -6
I think many guys are "reaching" here... At the time that a product is proposed, no fabric has been purchased. What would stop them from calling the factory and saying "Downsize the initial order we asked you to reserve for us by 30%" and then adjusting their 70% funded to 100%? Their is nothing deceitful, shady or dishonest about that, and *IF* numbers are being changed, that TO ME seems to be the only what that would make sense because its the only what that protects them financially by still not having to pay anything upfront on their end.
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Post by ickes on Oct 27, 2014 20:29:33 GMT -6
@untucked; speaking for myself here...but I wasnt implying that the fact that G tweaks their numbers to push products through funding is shady or unfair. actually it's quite the opposite as I believe it's beneficial to the customer. say you're the guy who loves a product and has backed it but it's moving slow. I can have faith that if the product funds to at least a certain percentage...GUSTIN will push it through. if they didn't I would be bummed if a product I really wanted made it to 80% or so but failed to make it.I wouldn't get my product just because a few more people didn't back it.
I think it's cool that G tweaks the numbers
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2014 20:49:36 GMT -6
@untucked; speaking for myself here...but I was implying that the fact that G tweaks their numbers to push products through funding is shady or unfair. actually it's quite the opposite as I believe it's beneficial to the customer. say you're the guy who loves a product and has backed it but it's moving slow. I can have faith that if the product funds to at least a certain percentage...GUSTIN will push it through. if they didn't I would be bummed if a product I really wanted made it to 80% or so but failed to make it.I wouldn't get my product just because a few more people didn't back it. I think it's cool that G tweaks the numbers Ditto. That's what I was trying to express also lol. Trying to speed type on my phone using Tapatalk..... I think people forget that Gustin is a business, and if campaigns don't fund, they don't get paid. |
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Post by brentkuz on Oct 28, 2014 9:53:36 GMT -6
Funny how the honey chore jumped!
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