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Post by exophobe on Oct 11, 2014 11:53:06 GMT -6
That's strange, I was all about it til I saw the dude start using it in the video, it seems really awkward, but I don't know if that's just because I was expecting him to be using it the other way.
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Post by Griffin on Oct 11, 2014 17:12:15 GMT -6
nope
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Post by wisdom on Oct 11, 2014 17:54:13 GMT -6
It looks interesting and has some unique innovations, like exposing only one half of the DE blade and spring-loaded hinge, but don't think it will shave better (or as well) as some vintage Gillettes that can be purchased for less than a fifth of the KS price. From my experience with DE razors (and this is a general consensus amongst the DE community), the only pressure you need when shaving with a DE is the weight of the head of the razor. If you're using so much pressure to flex a spring that is stiff enough to hold the head in place, you're probably pressing too hard.
At the KS price, and especially at the retail price, this razor is competing with both tried and true modern razors with beautiful design and top quality vintage razors plated in everything from gold to rhodium. It's competing against 100+ years of emergent razor design.. I won't be an early adopter of this, but am willing to listen to people's experiences, as skeptical as I am about the touted features.
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Post by exophobe on Oct 11, 2014 18:26:47 GMT -6
I'm thinking about it, but I did jump in for the early-bird tier in case they hit the goal. There are two issues I see with the design that just, in general go against the advantages of DE Safety Razors, but it might be crazy enough to hit right in the middle of a DE vs. straight razor shave. One of the bigger issues I see is that it takes over control of the shave angle, so if it doesn't work for you, you can try different blades but you won't be able to resolve any issues with technique, since it pulls technique out of the equation. Which is actually a major issue to those familiar with DE shaving.
Regarding the design, it looks cumbersome when he starts using it in the video. The thing about the DE Razor is that they have worked out those angles and curves to make it so you can get into the edge of the nostril without cutting your nose off, you can hit all those spots that are tough with a Mach3, and if you know you have a particularly sensitive area you can treat it with more care. With this guy, I think a lot of it will come down to the level of resistance that spring has, cause if you have to press hard with a DE Blade, I think you're asking for trouble. If you shave daily though, this might actually work really well, though. With longer whiskers, well, I'm interested to see home the "no-clog" design works.
The cost sort of makes sense, if the head is made of machined parts. Also, they're using the "cadillac of plastics"! Based on their funding goal, though, they seem to need the funding to create dyes and cast them. I don't think the project was specific about what process they're using. I might look into it a little more and that might actually be a large part of my decision to stay in the funding pool.
It's always nice to see new products (even if it will largely be a niche product) that help to ensure that companies won't stop making the DE blades, though, so it's good to see development still occurring in that area. I kind of wish it was designed more like the Merkur sideburn trimmer, with the blade at the thin edge, but with a flexible head that would likely go for the jugular. They could have significantly reduced bulk by using a design that advocates you snap the DE blades in half, or use the siingle edge blades like the mentioned Merkur. I don't think you could use the shavette blades since I believe they're a bit wider, could be wrong on that.
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Post by exophobe on Oct 31, 2014 21:06:34 GMT -6
Well kids, the Beluga funds in five days. I'm still swaying between 100% I've gotta have it and 100% "wtf am I thinking paying $100 for this thing". That thing has got a massive shave head on it, but it does look like it could actually be a pretty good balance between a classic DE shave and something like a mach 3, which interests me... So I think I'm gonna need some help on this one. Thoughts (besides why is this guy fretting over kickstarter projects late on halloween night)?
I've had really good luck to date, so the kickstarter model don't scare me none, but I am trying to get out of crowd-funding because I'm somewhat addicted, and it's been useful for fulfilling my goal of re-learning patience in consumerism (and Gustin... oh how Gustin has taught me the value of patience and "forgetting" to check your order status page), but I think I need to move on.
I already successfully talked myself out of the chambray scarf over there in G-Town (not a big scarf person, but it gets cold here and I learned their value - plus that is a beautiful color blue), but I'm having a hard time conserving this $100 of Beluga money.
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Post by exophobe on Oct 31, 2014 21:12:51 GMT -6
My one major concern with it is that the designers don't seem to have either A, ever used a DE Safety Razor, or B seem to know why they're superior to your 17 blade moisturizing strip cartridge shave system. And if they don't understand the DE razor, that means they have limited understanding of the way the blades are designed to work. Given that the design takes away the ability to adjust your angle using your wrist, that is a truly bothersome proposition. I'm starting to think the only advantage this thing would have over a typical cartridge system is that it doesn't use proprietary blades. My $35 Edwin Jagger safety razor probably offers a better value, and since I'm used to it likely a superior shave.
Is my desire for this gadget simply because it's new, novel, and will likely be rare? Or is it that I'm really hoping it fills some sort of need I don't even know I have until I get it?
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Post by Griffin on Nov 1, 2014 2:51:55 GMT -6
Look, you should never put preassure like that pivot on this kind of shaving, fail.
Its too clumpsy, how in earth are you gonna get under the nose....fail.
Clumpsy....you wont get around your face, only the flat areas, no the pivot wont help...fail!
Just let it go...it wont work. Look at the head of a DE razer and even thats a little thick under the nose.....cmon.
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Post by wisdom on Nov 1, 2014 8:11:23 GMT -6
Well kids, the Beluga funds in five days. I'm still swaying between 100% I've gotta have it and 100% "wtf am I thinking paying $100 for this thing". That thing has got a massive shave head on it, but it does look like it could actually be a pretty good balance between a classic DE shave and something like a mach 3, which interests me... So I think I'm gonna need some help on this one. Thoughts (besides why is this guy fretting over kickstarter projects late on halloween night)? I've had really good luck to date, so the kickstarter model don't scare me none, but I am trying to get out of crowd-funding because I'm somewhat addicted, and it's been useful for fulfilling my goal of re-learning patience in consumerism (and Gustin... oh how Gustin has taught me the value of patience and "forgetting" to check your order status page), but I think I need to move on. I already successfully talked myself out of the chambray scarf over there in G-Town (not a big scarf person, but it gets cold here and I learned their value - plus that is a beautiful color blue), but I'm having a hard time conserving this $100 of Beluga money. Hey, exophobe.. You probably figured I'd chime in about this I personally think it's overpriced, probably gimmicky to the point that it won't live up to the hype, and most importantly, takes a little bit away from the art of shaving. On the first point, you can buy a really nice, near vintage razor for the price of the KS and a pretty decent condition semi-grail class razor for the retail price. I'd recommend getting a British Aritocrat (Rhodium Plated) if you want one of the best, or go for an Aristocrat Jr. for sweet mechanical action and a sweet shave, or for an awesome shave at a ridiculously low entry price, a superspeeed or rocket. I'm running out the door right now, so will write more later, but here's the rest of my diatribe, real quick: Shaving is an art, plain and simple.. it's like anything that requires time to master. You gain a greater sense of appreciation for an art when you try to do it yourself. Any musician, artist, or barista can tell you that it wasn't until they tried to do it themselves that they truly appreciated why the masters were masters. Shaving is like this.. the tool should certainly be well made and well crafted, but the true pleasure is derived from being able to skillfully execute a craft in a manner and with a tool that allows you to control the outcome, not a spring or high-tech quintuple-bladed head. -\Visdom
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Post by exophobe on Nov 1, 2014 10:33:13 GMT -6
For a group of enablers you guys are good at this, too. Your concerns are reinforcing my concerns about the beluga, and i don't think it would bother me that much if the guys even acknowledged the de/wet-shave art.
I'm not going to say that it won't work. I can see how it would, just like the original cartridge shavers, and people ( for some reason) make electric shavers work, and those are gigantic. But do I need to pay $100 for something I'll likely use for a few shaves just to come to the realization I would have been better off with a similarly priced -- and likely far superior -- Classic DE razor. The top-end of merkur and boutique usa razors are at this price, and they're proven to be great.
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Post by Griffin on Nov 2, 2014 3:56:56 GMT -6
Also, a commercial that makes this thing similar to your own barber in the bathroom just gives me tv-shop vibes. It was funny sure, but a bad razor is not a joke. Sorry to sound pessimistic, but I just dont believe in it. They show almost nothing of actualy using the thing.
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Post by gaseousclay on Nov 2, 2014 9:45:42 GMT -6
I'm not convinced. Why reinvent the wheel? I've got about a dozen DE razors, half of which are fat handle techs, and they are still going to be superior in every way to this gimmicky contraption. All of my Gillette's are at least 60 to 70 years old and look new.i'll likely pass these on to my son when he's old enough to shave. This kickstarter campaign looks like they're trying to fund a cheese slicer
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Post by exophobe on Nov 2, 2014 9:57:29 GMT -6
To answer some of these questions, video. There are a couple things that reveals, one, the slot for the blade seems to go all the way through (which I think is good), and two, the design seems to have issues keeping the blade in contact with the skin (though some of the "stickier" shaving creams will exhibit this behavior independent of the razor). The pivot point doesn't seem as egregiously wrong as it seems, but the video actually seems to be better at discouraging me from buying it than encouraging me to.
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Post by exophobe on Nov 2, 2014 10:19:58 GMT -6
Here's a review. I read it and it sounded good, then I read through the stuff at the bottom (Our Expert Recommends) and found the "Five Recommended Razors" by the same author. It makes his review seem less genuine, and I feel it invalidates many of his opinions in the review.
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Post by gaseousclay on Nov 2, 2014 11:52:41 GMT -6
Here's a review. I read it and it sounded good, then I read through the stuff at the bottom (Our Expert Recommends) and found the "Five Recommended Razors" by the same author. It makes his review seem less genuine, and I feel it invalidates many of his opinions in the review. Didn't like his review, but agree that his 'five recommended razors' invalidates everything he says. Apparently all you need these days to become a 'men's hair expert' is a torso and limbs
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Post by Griffin on Nov 2, 2014 13:30:29 GMT -6
Ok so I can clearly see in that video that the blade will not contact everything under the nose.
And whats worse, the way he shaves should really make it bleed in some spots, and since it doesnt, it just means he isnt shaving close, wich puts us in the same boat as with a modern razor. He will have to really shave many times on the same spot.
Sure you cant do 1-pass with a DE either, but I can do 2 and be babayface on the cheeks and chin.
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Post by brentkuz on Nov 2, 2014 21:22:51 GMT -6
I've been using a DE safety razor since 2011.
1950's vintage Gillette super speed Astra blades Decently cheap badger hair brush. Forget the name I'm not at home. eBay stand Taylor of Old bond street shaving creams. Sandalwood, coconut and avocado currently love them. Polo safari and Taylor of old bond street sandalwood aftershaves.
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Post by exophobe on Nov 2, 2014 22:43:44 GMT -6
brent, I've probably been using one about as long. I have an edwin jagger and a Standard Razor (machined aluminum), I've tried several blades.. The Edwin Jagger loves Derby blades, and the standard works well with everything I've tried. I have a bunch of Personna blades but those really like to chew my face up in the EJ, they do pretty well in the standard. The brush I'm using is from an eshave starter bundle I got back when I started in on this, haven't seen any reason to replace it. Shaving creams I've tried quite a few since I figured out that crap in tubes is sin. My favorite is Imberial Barber Products unscented shave soap, and then I also use their bergamot aftershave. Others I have and use are Crux, Art of Shaving Sandalwood scent (weirdly one of my least favorite), Portland General Store Whiskey. For some reason I don't just buy Taylor of Old Bond Street and call it good, I have to keep looking at other stuff.
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Post by gaseousclay on Nov 3, 2014 10:02:04 GMT -6
brent, I've probably been using one about as long. I have an edwin jagger and a Standard Razor (machined aluminum), I've tried several blades.. The Edwin Jagger loves Derby blades, and the standard works well with everything I've tried. I have a bunch of Personna blades but those really like to chew my face up in the EJ, they do pretty well in the standard. I have quite a few vintage Gillettes, most of which are fat handle techs. I also have a Fatboy, Superspeed, Merkur 34c, Feather portable, etc. I exclusively use the Personna Reds and I've found they give me the best shave overall. there's a noticeable difference too in which razor you're using the blades in. For example, if I use the Personna's in my fat handle techs they give me the best shaves, and they're gentle on my skin. If I use them in my Merkur they shred my face. Every DE razor is designed differently and will thus hold blades differently. It's the same with the Feather portable. The key is to try and be as gentle as possible with certain DE razors, as this will make the difference between a smooth shave or a bloodied face
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Post by Derek G on Nov 9, 2014 4:47:17 GMT -6
wisdom exophobe @ gaseousclay I appreciate your experience, and your posts on this subject have been very helpful to me... I have found that my paps' schick krona (and my face) loves derby extra blades. If yeans don't mind, I'd like to pick your brains a little further.. Knowing the combo that I found so far... (I know that there are many other blades out there) could you recommend another blade to try? because the derbys are only the second brand I've tried Also, I found on the web, and at a local store, that a feather DE razor cost nearly 200 bucks!? Is this price justified? is there something about this razor that I'm missing? If so, what makes this razor so special? Also also I picked up an anchor brand straight razor at an antique shop...It looks to be NOS from a former barber school...It's a beautiful piece...I was going to try it...but, as I raised it to my throat...geeze...I'm scared to death of it...any advice on shaving with a straight razor? Also also also I need to ask brentkuz or stinky if they could produce a replacement leather piece for a strop like this ( link ) I have one similar to this, It may be the exact same make, I'll have to look, but the leather is old and dry. I'm not in the market for one quite yet, but it'd be nice to know if they could do it, and when I'm ready, purchase from one of our bros Thanks in advance for any info
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Post by wisdom on Nov 9, 2014 9:39:01 GMT -6
wisdom exophobe @ gaseousclay I appreciate your experience, and your posts on this subject have been very helpful to me... I have found that my paps' schick krona (and my face) loves derby extra blades. If yeans don't mind, I'd like to pick your brains a little further.. Knowing the combo that I found so far... (I know that there are many other blades out there) could you recommend another blade to try? because the derbys are only the second brand I've tried Also, I found on the web, and at a local store, that a feather DE razor cost nearly 200 bucks!? Is this price justified? is there something about this razor that I'm missing? If so, what makes this razor so special? Also also I picked up an anchor brand straight razor at an antique shop...It looks to be NOS from a former barber school...It's a beautiful piece...I was going to try it...but, as I raised it to my throat...geeze...I'm scared to death of it...any advice on shaving with a straight razor? Also also also I need to ask brentkuz or stinky if they could produce a replacement leather piece for a strop like this ( link ) I have one similar to this, It may be the exact same make, I'll have to look, but the leather is old and dry. I'm not in the market for one quite yet, but it'd be nice to know if they could do it, and when I'm ready, purchase from one of our bros Thanks in advance for any info Great questions, Derek, and I'm glad you're getting in to the whole wet shaving experience. If you're anything like me and have an addictive personality (Who am I kidding? We're all in this boat, here..) you are about to embark on another fun, exciting, enriching, and somewhat costly hobby. I'd recommend checking out badgerandblade.com before experimenting too much without a little guidance, as there's an amazing wealth of knowledge there about wet shaving and men's grooming, in general. Just a word of caution, though, you will likely have a whole new set of little packages arriving at your house that you'll need to explain to your SO as this typically leads to acquisition disorders of the razor, aftershave, brushe, scuttle, soap, pomade, etc. variety. I used Derbys when I first started and feel they're a great starter blade.. great quality at a great price. My personal favorites are Astras, though.. either the stainless steel or platinum variety shave wonderfully well. The SS version are sharper, but the platinums shave more smoothly. I'd give those a shot.. if you can get your hands on a sampler pack with Astras in them, I'd do that, just so you have a few blades to test out. westcoastshaving.com sells these, and I think they're available on eBay these days, too. $200 for a razor is a lot.. Feather makes a solid, modern razor that will last generations, but I'd prefer to spend the money on an old vintage Gillette. Some people swear by the newer Edwin Jagger's, Merkurs, Razors, etc, and I have a few in my rotation, but if I'm going to spend so much for a razor, I'd probably try to find one of the grails on eBay as these are becoming more and more rare and expensive as time goes on and wetshaving gains popularity. I've tried straights and used to do a straight shave on Sundays before I had kids.. not enough time anymore. You can get a sweet shave with one pass, but there's definitely more risk involved. Straights are super sharp, and accidentally bringing a stroke to your ear or nose will cut you, so will moving sideways (which I haven't done, yet, but know of many who have). I was slightly intimidated when I first shaved with a straight (90% of people can probably switch to a DE immediately in comparison), but it didn't take long to gain confidence and get a feel for what the blade is supposed to feel like when shaving through stubble. The most difficult thing for me to learn when straight shaving was how to hold the blade to shave different parts of my face. It feels really awkward at first and helps to watch a few videos or images of people shaving various parts of their face. You might be tempted to get a Shavette.. this is a straight with a disposable blade portion. You can learn form and feel with it, but shaving with a well sharpened, real straight, is actually easier and less rough. Keeping straights sharp are also a little more difficult, since you either need to send it out to someone who can hone it, or you need to learn how to hone it yourself. Stropping is also a technique that takes practice to perfect. All in all, straight shaving has a much steeper learning curve and involves many more skills. A dude named Tony Miller is pretty much renowned for making the most sought after strops. I'm not sure if this is still true, but this was the case a few years ago. You've probably also heard the terms WTG, XTG, and ATG (With the Grain, Across, Against).. I typically do a three pass shave that goes WTG, XTG, and ATG to get a BBS/DFS (baby-butt smooth or damn fine) shave..The chin and under the nose were the most difficult for me, both for DE and straight shaving. One thing that helps is letting the stubble grow for a day or so, just to see which direction it all grows. You'd be surprised at what direction you find the stubble actually growing.. around the neck, Adams-apple, jawline, etc., you may find the hair swirls or sweeps in directions you didn't expect. If you know which directions are W/X/A, it will make it easier to determine which direction to shave when you're doing your passes. Have fun
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Post by Old26 on Nov 9, 2014 9:54:23 GMT -6
We have a great shave shoppe here in Pasadena. I went with my wife and picked out what I want for Christmas - including a 60's NOS "OLD SPICE" lather dish (or whatever the f*** you call it!). Totally excited. The place has all sorts of nest things from the creams to razors to blades and brushes as well as colognes, etc. I spent two+ hours there going nuts. I can't wait to start. Now it's really kinds funny as I have the lamest "beard" around, but I still have to shave and I want to go old school now...
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Post by exophobe on Nov 9, 2014 13:00:39 GMT -6
I've never stepped up to a straight razor, thought on the shavettes for a while and then just decided to stick with the DE for now.
In any event, the DE blades I've tried, I found it really does depend on a number of factors, some of which I haven't put my finger on. My Edwin Jagger came with a Derby Extra, and it worked great, so I bought a sampler and they continued to work great. The Feather was a bit of a harsh shave (known for getting close) in the EJ, I have a bulk pack of Personna blades (the only ones still made in the USA) and they are just awful in the EJ.
I haven't had the Standard Razor very long, and have only tried Feathers, Personna, and Astra in it. The shave is really mild with this razor, and it seems to do okay regardless of what blade I put in it. The Astra was good, the feather probably the best, and the personna was about equal to the Astra. None of them have cut up my face.
The additional variable here, is that I'm always using a different soap, and the different soaps seem to vary the results as well. I've said it before, and the unscented Imperial is my absolute favorite, but I haven't done any Taylor of Old Bond Street, or the classic Italian bars and stuff that a lot of people swear by -- it's been my effort over the last few years to support and buy American as much as possible, even though it has sometimes cost me the experience of the highly regarded brands.
If the Standard were cheaper, I would recommend it hands-down as it is an amazingly easy DE shave, and seems to behave reliably regardless of the blade. My Edwin Jagger was a good starter, but it's definitely a higher learning curve than the standard. After the beginning of the year I'll probably pick up a Merkur 34C, since I've been wanting one for some time, though conversations here have me thinking that maybe an old Gillette would be the way to go. To be honest I'll probably pick up both at some point.
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Post by gaseousclay on Nov 10, 2014 9:40:04 GMT -6
@ wisdom - I second the sampler pack of blades as well as westcoastshaving.com. It's really a case of YMMV when it comes to shaving. I have a preference for Personna Reds because i've found them to be the mildest for my face and when paired with a Gillette fat handle tech. Personnas in my Merkur are a different story and have given me more cuts than i'd like. You pretty much have to go with trial and error for DE blades since every face is different.
As for Feather DE's being so expensive, my understanding is that their milled/forged in Japan, hence the added cost. I have a Feather portable that wasn't terribly expensive, and while it's a nice razor it seldom gets used. Once I discovered the Gillette fat handle tech all of my other DE razors essentially went into storage. I'll take them out every once in awhile but the tech is my go to razor.
I haven't delved into straight razor shaving yet, and don't know if I ever will. I have a healthy respect for sharp instruments and since I don't trust myself with a straight I don't think i'll take the plunge anytime soon. They are nice to look at though.
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Post by exophobe on Nov 10, 2014 10:38:54 GMT -6
@ wisdom - I second the sampler pack of blades as well as westcoastshaving.com. It's really a case of YMMV when it comes to shaving. I have a preference for Personna Reds because i've found them to be the mildest for my face and when paired with a Gillette fat handle tech. Personnas in my Merkur are a different story and have given me more cuts than i'd like. You pretty much have to go with trial and error for DE blades since every face is different. As for Feather DE's being so expensive, my understanding is that their milled/forged in Japan, hence the added cost. I have a Feather portable that wasn't terribly expensive, and while it's a nice razor it seldom gets used. Once I discovered the Gillette fat handle tech all of my other DE razors essentially went into storage. I'll take them out every once in awhile but the tech is my go to razor. I haven't delved into straight razor shaving yet, and don't know if I ever will. I have a healthy respect for sharp instruments and since I don't trust myself with a straight I don't think i'll take the plunge anytime soon. They are nice to look at though. I always figured the feather razor was so expensive just like Iron Heart is so expensive. Is it worth it? to some people absolutely, regardless of your perceived value. But I felt I was coveting it more because it costs a small fortune (in razor money) than for it's actual merits, so I stopped thinking about it. If I had too much money and no desire to keep it, I'd definitely own one of them, though. The Japanese seem to be like extra-obsessive Germans when it comes to manufacturing.
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Post by gaseousclay on Nov 10, 2014 11:07:52 GMT -6
I always figured the feather razor was so expensive just like Iron Heart is so expensive. Is it worth it? to some people absolutely, regardless of your perceived value. But I felt I was coveting it more because it costs a small fortune (in razor money) than for it's actual merits, so I stopped thinking about it. If I had too much money and no desire to keep it, I'd definitely own one of them, though. The Japanese seem to be like extra-obsessive Germans when it comes to manufacturing. I assumed people coveted Feather DE's because they're considered a precision/premium razor that works especially well for those with thick facial hair. I'm sure there are others that want the Feather because it costs a small fortune (like shell cordovan). For me the perceived value isn't there when compared to my vintage Gillettes. I'm sure the Feather is a great product and of high quality, but so are my Gillettes from the 1940's, and they were a fraction of the cost of a Feather. Likewise, my Merkur DE razor is a fine razor, but i'll put a fat handle tech up against it any day of the week.
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